Interview by: Hyana

Ghul: we actually had some plans to be in the UK on this tour but unfortunately, it just didn’t work out; there were clashes with the venues like double bookings and stuff. But I think we originally had the plan to go to the UK. Last time we were there was extremely successful, especially Manchester, which was good for us last time.

And you played here before in the Cradle of Filth, why did you switch to Mayhem?

With my previous band there was a kind of revolving door with people; no one really stayed very long, or very rarely anyway. There have been lots of people passing through that band. But that was the first real big thing that I did. But the reason I came to Mayhem was essentially because I knew Attila. I met Attila whilst being on the road with Cradle and we got along very well.  And we talked many times about working together.  I also knew Hellhammer from a few meetings.  And many times we talked about working together somehow. And then he emailed me one Christmas, or just after Christmas.  That was after I left Cradle, about a year and a half, two years in between, and he just said “hey, do you want to come over and do a rehearsal with us?”

So, you didn’t have to do an audition?

Well, it was like a rehearsal audition you know, just to see how it worked out, and that went really well.  So, then we just went from there; that was right at the beginning of 2012, I think.

If you Google darkest metal bands, Mayhem comes first…

The band has had quite a history obviously, and it’s one of these rare things where for the most part we never tried to be popular. 

Are you trying to distance yourselves from your past? 

No, it’s not that, it’s just that we’re doing what we feel like we want to do. We’re never doing anything to try to sell records or to try to be popular.  So it’s kind of funny that we end up being quite popular because we’re just doing what we want to do and we’re being authentic with what we’re doing, and we mean everything that we do. So it’s quite interesting that for such an extreme sound we have as many fans as we do. You wouldn’t think that many people would be able to deal with this kind of music, but yeah!

So there won’t be any controversial stuff?

With these guys there’s always stuff going on but nothing has got to the press yet.  I’m joking but it’s true: everyone in this band is kind of an extreme person. So everything’s always a little bit on the edge. 

So you’re choosing people who are extreme?

No, it’s not like that, it’s more that it’s really hard to explain. It’s a very specific kind of person who can survive in this world.  It’s not an easy life.  And to most normal people, our day-to-day normal stuff is alien and far removed from what a healthy-minded person would be able to deal with.  So I think it’s just inevitable that they are not just people who are attracted to this life but people who can survive this life, and that tends to be people who are a little bit outside society.

By the way, do you have to pay double health insurance or do they deem you uninsurable?

That’s a good question! We just don’t lie about what we do. It’s musician or entertainer. As long as they don’t Google the band name – I think we’ll be okay!

Metal can be depressive. Does it affect your mental health?

I don’t know because I don’t think my mental health is very good in the first place.  It’s hard to say. I mean, I wrestle with demons as much as anybody does, maybe more so than the average person, but I think that this is a kind of depressive music, and it’s not only metal, it’s all kinds of depressive music.  I’m a massive fan of Shostakovich and his music is extremely depressing.

So why do you listen to it?

Because it’s kind of cathartic, it cleanses you of those bad feelings somehow, because you embrace them. And it’s difficult to articulate, but it’s kind of therapeutic in a way. And, you know, and I have my moments. Most of us in the band have a wide range of things that we listen to.

Apart from metal and depressive stuff, do you listen to anything else?

Oh yeah, but only mainly 80s stuff. I love the stuff like Duran Duran and Cindy Lauper and Madness and stuff… But I have to be in the right frame of mind for that, you know. I have to be in the right kind of mood, that’s party music. But if I’m in an introverted mood and I want to think or just be calm, then I won’t listen to it. You’re right, I never really thought about it but most of the music that I really like is kind of depressing.  Not all of it, but yeah, I definitely lean more towards darker music.

Do you think this kind of music has an effect on your life?

Yeah, I guess so. I mean, I don’t listen to metal as much as I did when I was young. Before I was doing it for a living, I listened to a lot more classical music, stuff written between about 1850 and the late 19th, 20th century. So yeah, like Shostakovich, that would be a good example, and Debussy, Wagner, this kind of composer. That’s something that I listen to a lot nowadays.

Do you blend it into the music that you make now?

I guess it inevitably bleeds in a little bit, you know. But I still listen to metal and I still get the same feeling from it that I always did. It’s just a bit different because I’m immersed in it all the time when I’m working. So it’s nice to get a break.

It seems you’re a different person on the internet… You’re not trying to put a character on your social profile as well as on stage?

So it’s different parts of the same whole! I really think that everybody has different compartments to their personality. And what happens on stage is: kind of all of my negativity and anger and disappointment and all the demons that I have. And it’s a way that they can just be in control for an hour and a half, two hours on stage. They get to run everything. And then, when I’m off, you know, and especially if I’ve had a few drinks, then a slightly lighter side comes out. And it’s a different version, but it’s the same person. It’s just different sides of the same person. And I think if you don’t have that balance, then you run into the risk of becoming an incredibly… I mean, if you’re too positive all the time, I think you just become very naive and empty-headed. But if you’re too negative all the time, you never do anything because there’s no reason to.

You’re saying that playing on stage is a form of release?

Yeah, it’s a way that all of the worst parts of myself can be in charge for a while and get all of that bs out of you, so then I can be a slightly nicer person when I’m up, when I’m in the real world. It’s the same if I’m writing music. I try to pour that stuff in there, rather than into my real life. So if I behaved how I do on stage in a supermarket it wouldn’t be great for society.

And do people recognise you?

Yeah, actually quite often now and which is nice and it’s fine. And it’s almost always very easy and respectful.

What’s the usual interaction like?

It’s just cool they’re just sort of they look nervous and come up and just you can see that they’re sort of looking and they get a bit closer and a bit closer. Of course, I have my nice days and my bad days, but I always try to be nice to people if they’re coming to say, speak to me about what I do creatively because that’s really such a beautiful thing for someone to do to just come and say something nice to you for no reason, if you know what I mean.

There were no bad interactions?

No, not really. I mean you meet the odd person, some people are very negative, this is what goes back to what I was saying, if you’re just negative all the time it kind of consumes you and some people are very much like that and some people prefer to have something bad to say, rather than something good to say. But I would say 99.9% of all of my interactions with fans have always been very positive.

Do you interact with them after the show?

Sometimes, it really depends. Some days i’m just not there and it wouldn’t be good for me to go and speak to people because I’ll just be grumpy and rude but I always try to. I try to always give people the time because they’ve spent money and time to come to the show so it’s the very least I can do – to try to be appreciative of that.

After the concerts, do you go out and talk?

Depends… It depends on the venue, firstly, because sometimes the bus is hidden behind, you know, locked away so not always. But if I’m passing by people and they want to speak to me then I’ll always either stop or do what I need to do and then come back because like I said I think it’s the least I can do.

And what do you do for relaxation?

I’m a gamer.  And I’ve always been, ever since I was really small, always been obsessed with video games.  You know, typically me, it’s only like solo.  Not multiplayer stuff, usually it’s like story-driven stuff or RPGs.  But when I’m on tour, I’m trying to work.  Actually, I have this other project, R Complex, which is sort of loosely connected to video games.

What’s your favourite game to play?

At the moment I’m playing this really bizarre… Like a Dragon, which is a Japanese role-playing game. It’s really, really weird, it’s about this gangster. It’s a really weird game, but there’s something so uniquely Japanese and interesting about it that I’ve just kind of got sucked into it. I’ve also started to get into VR gaming as well.

Do you have pets at home? XD

Yeah, I do. I’ve actually lived most of my life around animals one way or another.

Like in the countryside?

No, just in the house. I’ve never lived in the countryside, which is a shame because I kind of want to. But I think maybe nowadays it would be too quiet for me because I’m used to living in towns. But my mother grew up on a farm out in the countryside. So I grew up with this one half of the family being very countryside and animals and, you know, nature and growing things. And then the other side with my father’s side was from London. So it was a total, total contrasted household. But I really would love to live in the countryside, actually. I think that that would be my ideal way to retire. Although I don’t think I ever will retire, to be honest.

Do you want to play in the band all your life?

I think maybe not in the band but, I mean, I also do composition work and that kind of things. I just can’t imagine ever wanting to stop. I know a lot of people look forward to retiring, it’s like the goal that “I can’t wait to retire and relax.” I don’t want that. I would hate it. I wouldn’t know what to do with myself when I have two-three days off work I just start to get agitated I want to do something even if it’s just, you know, to write some riffs or do something. I’m like very very bad at taking time off.

Doesn’t music take a lot of creativity and soul out of you?

Actually, it’s a funny thing because it’s a sort of love-hate thing with music. I actually hate writing music because it makes me so… I feel so empty and disappointed all the time until it’s finished and I like it. And then suddenly that feeling is such an overwhelming sense of relief and joy, that it’s kind of worth it. But when I’m writing music, when I am actually really working on music, it’s the absolute worst time to be around me because I’m in a really bad mood all the time! I have such an incredibly high standards for myself and nothing I do ever sounds good to me.  And then some days I’ll finally get to a point where I think “okay, this sounds good” and then the next morning when I listen to it, and I hate it, it starts all over again, a bad cycle.

How do you reach that point when you’re satisfied?

I wish I knew, it just happens eventually.  I wish I knew the shortcut to that because it would make life a lot easier. It’s just a gut feeling, it’s just a sense of “aha, I like this!” It’s the same as when you hear a song by someone else and it just grabs you.  It’s the same kind of thing when it’s your own work.  You just know if something makes you feel good about it.

Do you have someone or some band that inspires you?

Mostly dead composers, to be honest. My biggest inspiration in my whole life actually is John Williams – the film composer. He’s kind of the reason I got into music in the first place, from his soundtracks and still now it’s where I go, when I really need to be inspired I’ll just listen to his work or pick up one of his scores and sort of study it and look at it and just think how far behind him I am as a creative and that just pushes me.

But John Williams and Mayhem music are different?

Very different, but music is music you know. And you’d be surprised when you start digging around in his work… How dissonant and aggressive a lot of the tones are. It’s just that it’s so well written that you don’t really notice it but if you put those kinds of sounds on a distorted guitar it sounds pretty extreme, almost too extreme actually. So you’d be surprised. I mean music is music. This is the reason I got into metal. I never really hear music how it is delivered as much as I hear the content of the music. So what I mean by that is it doesn’t matter if it’s on an electric guitar and someone’s screaming over it or if it’s an orchestra or it’s a harp, I just hear the content more than I hear the presentation if that makes sense. I don’t know why it is, i’ve just always been like that.

So you’re not really enjoying music because you’re concentrated on bits of it?

No, it’s not like that, it’s more than that. I guess, i’m sort of concentrating on the soul of it rather than its external appearance. It’s a difficult thing to explain but it’s just I hear music as music, regardless of whether it’s a punk band or an orchestra or a synthesizer, I suppose that’s the best way to say.

Do you still live in the UK?

No, I live in the Netherlands. It’s a lot easier in terms of travel and especially being very close to the main hub. I usually get to the airport there in Amsterdam. It’s not really in Amsterdam, but that’s perfect because I get basically direct flights everywhere, which makes life easy. The guys in Oslo – they almost always have to do a connection flight before. Like if you’re going to Australia or something they have to do a bunch of flights to get there, whereas I can usually do a quick jump to China and then over to Australia or something like that.

Oh yeah you said that you get bored, so you never get into misunderstandings?

Oh yeah constantly. I mean it’s like the family so there’s always something. Actually it’s been a lot better in recent years but there’s always arguments.

What are the main disagreements?

Oh, it’s stupid stuff. It’s the kind of stuff you get in a house, just pointless arguing about nothing and people just being in a bad mood, being grumpy, getting under each other’s feet. Sometimes you have a bad show, but it’s never anything major and there’s never any bad feeling that lasts. It’s all fine. We managed to be a pretty tight unit actually. We have a pretty good relationship between us all, so it’s never anything major, it’s just stupid stuff, the kind of stuff you just argue with a brother or sister about, you know, just bs. 

What are your favourite metal bands?

Probably the most influential for me would be Emperor because that was the band where I could hear the definite crossover between all the different kinds of music that I liked.

Do you think the views of your band are the same as they were at the beginning?

It’s kind of… I don’t know, really.  We’re the same people, put it that way. Of course, times change and things change, but I don’t think rights and wrongs change. Without going anywhere near this subject, I think that the society’s perspective on right and wrong has become incredibly strangely twisted in the last 15-20 years. And so we are very much people who just stick with what we believe is the right thing, whether it’s popular or not. And when it comes to the art, the meaning behind the art, we try to just remain true to what we want to do. And if people don’t like it, or if it makes people angry, that’s good for the business!

How did you meet other band members? 

Hellhammer – that was during my festival, through Sarah (Jezebel Deva). She was singing for Cradle and had done work with The Kovenant. They’re doing stuff again now.  She introduced me to him and that’s how I met him first. 

Atilla – I think he came to one of the Cradle shows, or something like that, and we just ended up chatting a bit. It just went from there really, and we kind of maintained contact for quite a few years.  And then I think it was around 2008 when Blasphemer first left Mayhem and they were looking for someone new.  I was even talking with him back then about the idea of coming over to play with him, but it took a few more years, before the stars aligned.

Are there bands you consider to be rivals of Mayhem?

Not really. I think what we do is just completely unique. There aren’t many bands, or any bands, who sound quite like us. You have bands who sound like De Mysteriis album, but you don’t really have bands who have this kind of widely diverse musical catalogue. De Mysteriis and Grand Declaration of War just sound nothing like each other. They’re like completely different bandwagons. So I don’t really think that there are any rivals to us because no one can even do this. Most people who play black metal don’t have the same technical ability to play the super technical stuff that we play.